The Tao of Gaming

The One Hundred will start discussions and generate controversy, as all these lists invariably do. Far be it from me to refrain. As nice as the compilers of the list are, I think it has serious problems. It's bad enough they drank they Kool-aid; now they're spiking it!

So this is a public service announcement. I'm not sure if the 100 lists influential games, because one of the voters indicates that the chief criterion is "games you play." I'm going with that.

Let's start with the methodology. From the post —

I began by asking a select group of hardcore gamers (mostly Eurogamers) to send me a list of their fifteen favorite games, listed in order. 65 gamers replied.

If you ask a lot of gamers, I'm sure that they'll probably each have maybe 5-10 of the same games. Puerto Rico, Settlers, Ticket to Ride, Carcassone, etc. etc etc. The rest of the votes will be all over the place. So the top places get lots of votes, the middle ones get a fair number, and then the tail end you have single votes or two votes. I mean, there are only 975 games listed. If you assume that each of the big five get 40 votes each (2/3rds of the list) and that say ten games get 20 votes each (1/3rd), that leaves ~675 votes for 85 games. I wouldn't be surprised if the final few games only show up on 3-4 lists.

Given that the goal was to produce "The One Hundred", it would have been far better for people to list say, 25 games. Or Fifty. Then one or two advocates wouldn't be enough to unbalance it. Everyone would vote for their "Great 5 or 10" and then fill out the other slots nicely. I suspect that the list improves once we get into the top fifty or so. But there are some howlers so far -- McMulti? (At #97) OK, I'll grant that it influenced Settlers; How many rip offs has Monopoly influenced? Shantraj influenced chess. That may make it influential, but not fun. I got McMulti because of the hype (a decade ago) played it a handful of times over the years, and sold it. I would have never considered this in the top 100 games I've played. I just checked, my rating is a 5, aka 40th to 60th percentile. Not bad, not good. Around 350th in my rank of games rated. Out of 700).

I also give Mamma Mia (#96) a five, but I do prefer it to McMulti. At least the order was right!

But by far the worst appearce belongs to Capitol at #95. I played this game once, and won with a final of something like 47-46-46 (or maybe 47-47-46) and felt nary a sliver of tension. I've been bored with games with a runaway leader. Let's use the words of one of the voters (Frank Hamrick, whom I've gamed with in NC and is a nice guy):

Capitol almost didn't make it because it never gets played! This ... is one of my absolute all-time favorites that seldom gets played.

He's right there. I can't recall seeing this played since it came out. [This must be a local thing, since the voters on the Geek like Capitol much more than I do. But they still only place it at #165].

To be fair, the bulk of the the other games are inoffensive, but still damn few that I'd place in the Top 100. (I suspect I'd give Backgammon a nod, or be tempted to. I did go through that phase where I played a thousand games against a strong AI to try and improve). [I rate it a 7, which means it's in my top 123].

Ah well, gotta run. More bombs later!

Update: If I had voted, I would have tossed a vote at Shadowfist. Presumably I'd be the only voter to do so, so it would (rightfully) be left of the list. But if each voter picked one game they love that nobody else does, then there are even less votes to go around. And if a fewpeople like the same 'outlier', then it's in.

The more I think about it, the more I think that each person needed to get more votes, and probably not even fifty. Twenty-five would mean that if each person picks about seven "locks" (for the top 20 or so), then they still have a lot of slots (18) to sort out the rest of the hundred. But right now, even if they only pick four locks, they still only have 11 slots for the rest. [And if they picked seven ...]

I'm tempted to let people send me their Top 25. But I'm busy & lazy, so I'll wait for temptation to pass.

Update: I missed Samurai and Chinatown, which seem well place in the 80-100 range (Samurai is the only game on the list with a higher BGG placement). The GIPF games are also fine, I don't play them often, but I see the appeal.

Correction: Oops. Battle Cry matches rank exactly; Dune and Dvonn are also higher on the BGG Top 100 than The Hundred. And I have insulted more games in the comments.

More thoughts ...

Would it help if I couch my carefully thought out and totally rational criticisms in a more blatantly provocative manner? I was just thinking that gaming could use a gonzo journalist. Besides Grognads, I mean. We've all seen R.T. strung out on more drugs than a Walgreens, but it doesn't really affect his writing.

Snoop and Mark spoil my fun by posting a quality jump sooner than expected. (That's not entirely true. Again about half of the games don't belong in the top 100 by my judgement, but they're more '6s' than '5s'. And easy to see a case for.)

6 Nimmt (#80) — Not bad. Fluffy. In the 250-300 game rank range (depending on if you use game rank or overall rank. I'm not sure which to use). I've had good results against people who play randomly; there's definitely skill involved. Don't know how much, though. A six.

Mystery Rummy (#79) — Again in the 200s. I hadn't actually ranked this game, but it's a five or six.

Was Sticht? (#78) This was the bee's knees, but remember that those little bastards sting. A five that I quit playing quickly. Still, The Hundred could do much worse. It's been out of favor for a while and is a damn sight better than most trick taking games that get churned out like cheap butter.

I like War of the Ring (#77), and can't really complain on it's inclusion in the list. Given the list is based on "Fun" and "playing the game", it fits. (I've been telling people that it's a fun game, not a good one). I'm even happy with the placement — BGG is out of whack making this a near Top 10 game.

Hare & Tortoise (#76/75) — Classic game that holds up well. The geek only his this in the 300-400s, but I agree with the voters that this belongs. As Snoop says, "You're right, and I hate it when that happens."

Quandry (#76/75) — That's ok, I was a Knizia Groupie for a long time too. A fine game that will struggle mightily to uphold the noble tradition of The Hundred, a task it is wholly unprepared to fulfill.

Taboo (#74) — I'm more of a Celebrities type of guy, personally. But if you are going to have a party game or two, I can respect this.

Even though I only rate Twilight (#73) a five, it could be higher. Haven't played enough to tell. This falls into the Was Sticht category — A new trick taking game with something going for it. A rare bird out of the hundreds to flood the market.

I liked Basari (#72) enough to buy it twice. Moving along...

Wow. Breaking Away (#71). I had completely forgotten about this. I haven't played it in a decade (and haven't actually seen a copy since then, I think). It may be nostalgia talking, but I concur. [And just rated the game a 7 and added it to my want list. Not going to pay 75€ + shipping to buy the copy for sale...

So I'll humbly admit that the quality has shot up, and a few sleeper selections make me pause and reflect. The 'rank 15' mechanic let a bunch of shaky games, but it gave an opening to some spry elders, too.

Now that everyone is relaxed and friendly, the latest Ten.

Scrabble shows up at #70. I'm going to shock everyone — it should be higher on the list! What can I say, the fact that several million people who've never heard of Euro games play it counts for something.

Flascenteuful at #69. You know, I sound like a broken record, but it's one of those trick taking games that is actually interesting. And, in my mind, the most thematically correct card game I've ever seen. (Maybe the only one). I'll admit that I've been tempted to rate this a seven.

I recently (OK, last year) bumped my rating of Ave Caeser [#68] up to a seven. [For most people, seven is low, but that means it's a borderline Top 100 in my book, for those keeping score at home].

I just bought the expansion to Citadels [#67], so I can't really argue. Hey, I wonder what's in the expansion? I should open it....

Elfenland [#66] did win a Spiel des Jahres. I'll consider it a substitute for Elfenroads, which I prefer and would still own if I hadn't gotten a very nice offer for my collection of White Wind games (of which I played only two regularly. The other is Sante Fe, which I consider to be the finest of the lot and a borderline candidate.

History of the World [#65] has never intrigued me, but I know lots of people like it. Moving on...

Seeing as how much I've thought about Lord of the Rings: The Confrontation [#64], I've got no complaints. I'm debating buying the deluxe edition...

I've only played San Marco [#63] once, and it was with four players. Given the debate on "Best with 3", I may be missing out.

I've got mixed feelings on Smarty Party [#62]. The limited replayability is one issue. [I never bought a copy in North Carolina, becuase there were a few floating around. I don't think Jacqui has ever played]. The other issue is that the cards have certain areas of knowledge that are repeated. (Like games). Also, many of the categories ask for factual answers that may depend on the source and time (like largest countries by population) or completely subjective answers (like famous prisons, or most popular movies featuring actor X). This bothered me more than it should, I think. I think that people could (given a week or so warning) make up their own cards, which would be interesting. Or perhaps just have a website repository of new cards. I think that Smarty Party (as published) falls short of great, but it could be made great quite easily. So, I guess I concur!

Stephenson's Rocket [#61] is on the cusp with that ever popular seven rating, but I actually sold my copy. Given that it's a no luck game, it suffers from the same fate as the 18xx series of games. It's got enough going on so that new players are going to be hard pressed to beat a veteran.

There's actually a large category of games that I don't pull out because the learning curve means that it won't be as enjoyable. Right now I play Puerto Rico and San Juan mainly online (I'll teach and play San Juan because it's a short game). I learned 1830 by losing my first 5-10 games, an investment of 30-50 hours. Many people, even gamers, will get frustrated at that. Titan has a learning curve, but a player could always get obscenely lucky to win. (Several locals have expressed an interest, so I may start tossing Titan in the bag). Stephenson's Rocket isn't nearly so bad, I may buy the reprint.

But back to the #100. These games, in general, get the coveted stamp of approval. Some that I wouldn't personally pick, but nothing egregiously bad. [OK, that's probably true of the rest, but you know what I mean]. And I've gone and checked a few boxes on the geek that say "I want this in trade." Always nice to be reminded that I don't own that and wouldn't mind playing it.

Let's go to the tape...

I own Blokus (#60). Blokus is a good friend of mine. And, who knows, maybe it deserves to be on the list.

I own many of the Card Driven Wargames, and have even played a few, but I've never gotten to try Hannibal: Rome vs. Carthage [#59]. Many people love it.

Wizard [#58] is a remake of Oh, Hell. I remember playing it once or twice and grad school and thinking .... "Eh, I could just play Oh, Hell!" Since we know that traditional card games can make the list (via Spades), is this game really that much better than the original? I seem to recall that some of the cards reminded me of the dots in Bridgette, you don't have to follow suit, but you lose the trick. A cute idea, but given that it'sabout getting the exact number of tricks (not most), a bit of a monkeywrench. I personally wouldn't put either on the list. But if I were, I'd stick with the original.

I dislike Schnappchen Jagd [#57]. Ok, dislike is strong. I can take it or leave it, and usually leave it. Some of my best friends play SJs (damn Papists).

I knew I was going to see Diplomacy [#56]. I didn't expect to see Larry's comment — "In my opinion, the greatest game creation of the first 70 yearsof the twentieth century."

I respectfully dissent. According to Calhammer, a correctly played game of diplomacy should never end, but just be an ever-shifting morass of loyalties and properties. [I actually got "Calhammer on Diplomacy" to read at the Gathering last year, I think it was in that, but it may have been from some nameless interview]. When a game's creator says the game shouldn't end, and says it glowingly, I think that should be a strike.

Besides, Bridge beats Diplomacy like a Red headed stepchild (or Turkey).

Wallenstein [#55] rocked my world, in the sense that we kept jolting the table and knocking cubes out of the tower. As a game, I haven't felt a strong urge to seek it out; I'd play it again if offered.

Can't Stop [#54]. I have a mildly snarky comment. Ooh, that would really punch it up. ... Adding a d20 joke would make it great. Damn, over the top. Your turn. (A fine choice).

One of the first games I reviewed, I've got no beef with Daytona 500 [#53], either.

Ricochet Robots [#52], in my world, was a flash in the pan. But I can see how others like it. Now that I think about it, it probably is my favorite puzzle game (over Black Vienna), since it doesn't require notes or tedious downtime. Still, 'My favorite puzzle game' is kind of like 'Buddy Hacket's family friendliest joke'. [Not counting Haggle. That's a puzzle/party game, and loads more fun...]

Go [#51] doesn't even make the Top half? Man the barricades! I'm not sure I'd list it in my Top 15, but I spent years of my life (and lots of money) trying to get good at this. [I didn't, so I'm reduced to bitterly posting a blog...]. I'm sure that somewhere, Go is just sitting back, listening to the other games crack wise, and thinking "This, too, shall pass."

More wacky hijinks tomorrow. [I need to get out and game].

This is where I thought the quality would jump. Did it?

I personally think it's too early for Goa [#50] to be in the list. But it's a good game.

Poker shows up at [#49]. Fine. Of course, Poker is really a category of games instead of a particular game. I like the formalized, Casino type games (although dealer's choice with the right group is fun). But it's chimerical nature means that anyone (who isn't opposed to gambling) can find something there.

Adel [#48]. Check. I've considered buy the reprint, even though I have the original. That 6th player ...

No surprise I'm happy to see Titan [#47] on the list, it's in my Top 10. Let me just take umbrage at one of the comments -- "The tactics of the battle board are fairly easy to learn, but ...". The tactics on the battleboard aren't easy. I remember a CS grad student at CMU who wanting to write a Titan AI (for battles only) and getting overwhelmed. [The pathfinding task can be particularly daunting for a computer, but humans don't do it so well either]. There are some easy hueristics ... Please don't write me any letters of recommendation, Josh.

I like Attika [#46], too, and would have voted for it.

Like Joe Huber, I wonder if 1830 [#45] is just a stand in for the entire system. I'd probably prefer '70 or '56 (for novelty), and I'd love to get Tom Lehmann's latest entry which is for sale, but I need a group I can play it against before I justify the cost. [I'd buy the deluxe version. I mounted my own copy of 1841. Never again!] I'd be surprised to see any other entrants in the genre. The first (in the US) is dominant.

Speaking of which, I was shocked to see Lowenherz [#44]. Domaine made the list, and these games aren't that different. So that means that they both have a reasonable following. Now, I've only played this one, twice or so, and I thought Domaine was clearly superior. I guess I'm in the majority. I also think the games are close enough that their votes could have been wrapped up (which probably would have only bumped this up 5-10 spaces, at most). Let another game in! Free the #101! [Of course, at that slot, who knows what it would have been?]

Traumfabrik [#43]. No real complaints. I wonder what the highest rated game that I'm actively bad it (meaning, like and rarely win) will be? Right now, #43.

Kicking Diplomacy around, Bridge drops in at [#42]. A touch low, but it's an acquired taste. Like Titan and 18xx, "Play a lot or play it not" in my book. (Sadly, my online game has collapsed, due to my moving one time zone and some recent babies among partners.) Incidentally, Larry Levy's point that Bridge 'evolved' (vs Diplomacy's design) is a good point. I'll withdraw Bridge from the challenge, but still point to Scrabble and Acquire.

I must have played For Sale [#41], but I haven't rated it, so I doubt I've played it twice.

So, about 8 games that I think belong, one I think doesn't (Lowenherz, although I think Domaine is borderline) and one I have no opinion of. So, basically I'm fine with all of the games! Should be smooth sailing to the contentious finals.

A very quick summary of the latest fifteen.

I can't argue with including this batch, but if you offered me the choice of playing one of these at random and playing one of the last set (41-50), I'd take the later.

I actively want to play Roads and Boats [#37], becuase I haven't tried it, and I wouldn't mind playing most of them. On the other hand, I disliked Civ's [#26] time/fun ratio (the single play I've tried), sold Torres [#33] quickly, played only a handful of Roborally [#32] before tiring of it, and have described my feelings about Tikal [#40]. (Hmm. My review on BGG isn't there. I must have forgotten to transfer it.).

On the other hand, I really like Kardinal & Koenig [#35] (and even played China twice last month).

So -- Fine games that I mainly respect and ignore. Make of that what you will.

After apathetic praise comes ... more of the same.

Lost Cities [#25]. Not for me. I play at the Gathering's tournament, because what else am I going to do? My plane leaves soon, so I can't play something long, and it's either this or watch. Lots of people love this.

Have I blogged about La Citta [#24]? Yes, I have. [Short summary -- 'lacks zing'].

You knew it was coming. I knew it was coming. Taj Mahal shows up at #23. I was going to pass this by quietly...

Pat Korner: "The ultimate mix of tactics and strategy, combining poker-style bluffing and tactics...

Die Macher shows up at #22. Like many of the people voting for it, I haven't played in years. I don't know if I'd put it in my Top 15 (which is to say, If I'd have voted for it), but I would have voted for Titan. Fair's fair.

I haven't played Memoir '44 recently either, but I'm buying the Ancients copy of Command & Colors, so no complaints.

Mu & Mehr hits the Top 20. I'd be surprised to see a higher ranked card game. I loved it for a long time, but eventually came around to the view (first expressed to me by Jeff Goldsmith) that there are too many trumps (potentially) and the suits are a bit too short. I haven't played in years, but as I rarely play card games, that's not surprising. [Really, the only one I remember suggesting in years is Flauschentuefel].

Medici [#19]. Ok, I would have been tempted to put this in my Top 15. It's an '8' right now. [I rate 12 games a '10' or '9', and 26 games an '8']. I don't think I'd vote for it, but I'd regret skipping over it. Just how many games does Reiner have in the Top 100?

I'm a Crokinole [#18] well-wisher, in that I wish it no specific harm. [I just wanted to use that line]. It's a fine game. I haven't sprung for a board, but I don't have a problem playing. I've had one good run at it, but I'm mediocre.

Time's Up, by Peter Sarrett shows up at #17. My favorite party game. Peter ignored me when I told him that he should turn Celebrities into a TV gameshow, going for the board game route. Just goes to show how ignoring me pays off. I normally just play Celebrities, because I like a) seeding the bag, b) multiple copies of the same name appearing (or having that possibility), c) some names are trademarked, so don't appear in tha published game. [But I do own the game, Peter!].

Incidentally, for a long time we went through a 'theme' phase (where all the names we put into the bag would have a theme). That got old faster than you'd imagine. Subtle themes can work, though.

No problems with Union Pacific at #16, either. I should toss it into the bag again. Say ... does anyone have the rules for the updated (newer) setup? I seem to recall that they changed (at least for the Gathering tournies)?

Just to allow the mocking to go both ways, my Top 15.

1. Shadowfist
2. San Juan
3. Puerto Rico
4. Bridge
5. Titan
6. Power Grid
7. Scrabble
8. 1830
9. Apples to Apples [I've been playing with my children recently, and it works here too]
10. Age of Steam
11. Poker
12. Attika
13. Web of Power / China
14. Ursuppe
15. War of the Ring

The last few slots are contentious, and I could see reordering the top slots around. Go, Time's Up, Acquire, Colossal Arena, Settlers, Struggle of Empires all call to me for the last few slots. War of the Ring and Attika may be too new to really deserve their votes, but there you have it.

1830 is a somewhat tactical vote. I've played 1830 so much that I'd rather play 1856 or 70 (or a new one), but I can't see any of the other games getting enough votes to make the list (much like Joe Huber mentioned for 2038). On the other hand, I would have been shocked to see Shadowfist appear on anyone else's list, but I've played it ten times more than any other game (face to face) over the last five years. [And it's not necessarily short, either].

The Hundred steps up with another quintet...

I agree with Mark that Saint Petersburg will fall down from #15 next year. It's an addictive little game ... for a while.

Not surprising to see Cosmic Encounter at #14. A classic, but one that shows some age with a highly variable playing time. Truthfully, if it weren't one of the first games I encountered (and therefore played to death), I'd probably still be playing it.

Bohnanza strikes at #13. Moderately surprising (although I suppose by now I should be tracking what hasn't shown up to figure out the Top 10). I still play one and off. And it's had consistent sales. But Bohnanza always struck me as one of those games that burst onto the scene, burned brightly for a year or two, and then flamed out. Then again, many games follow that pattern for me, but only burn for a few weeks or months...

Somewhat surprised to see Lord of the Rings [#12], although I guess I shouldn't be. A very dedicated following, and (practically) unique on the list means a high rating. Despite rating it an '8', I never thought of putting it in my Top 15.

Acquire just misses the Top 10. Ok.

All fine games, of course.

So, what haven't we seen? Here are the ones I can think of that may be contenders for the final ten.

• Puerto Rico
• Euphrat und Tigris
• Power Gird
• Prince of Florence
• Tichu
• El Grande
• Age of Steam
• Paths of Glory (admittedly a long shot, given the voters)
• Settlers of Catan
• Chess
• Magic
• San Juan (Ok, I hope it's there).

There are a few dark horses that could sneak in (Up Front, Game of Thrones, etc), but unless I've just missed them in my quick glance, I think we've got the final ten covered. Although I could be wrong about Age of Steam. Was it widely available 12 months ago? I seem to recall that it just hit the stores again in February...

Update: Ticket to Ride hasn't shown up yet either, has it? Simple. Spiel des Jahres. It could easily bump a game.

Ok, rather than just have a new post each day for two games, I'm just going to update this one as The Hundred reveals the top 10.

Tichu [#10] and Ra [#9} make the list simply to prove the discerning intelligence of the Tao of Gaming commentors.

I'd put Ra in my personal Top 15 and maybe Top 10. Of course, I put Tichu in the closet, but yeah, everyone and their dog, phoenix, dragon and bird has played this. I think one reason was summed up a bridge partner. He was discussing Bridge, but it applies to Tichu. Paraphrased "Chess is too hard, and requires concentration and discipline. But I can focus intensely in small bursts, and see the outcome almost instantly. Then I have a cigarette." True with Tichu. Play a hand, relax a bit while the cards are shuffled up and dealt. Play another...

Update: Two more days worth of games: Ticket to Ride [#8] -- As a popular 'gateway' game, no real surprise that it's at the Top 10.

I am surprised Age of Steam [#7] beat it, even though I much prefer AoS. Checking the comments on the post, I see Chris Farrell's point about the problems with AoS. It's true, there are some real issues (the producer role, the artificial endgame based on number of turns instead of the more elegant 18xx system). In general, my quick thoughts are:

• It seems clear that 'elegance' is not an over-riding concern of the voters (Go at #51. Prosecution rests, your honor).
• I personally don't think that the heavily unbalanced roles is a serious issue. As an auction game, the fact that somethings are worth more or less isn't a big issue. Whereas if you just selected the roles in player order, the issue would loom larger.
• The endgame effects are clearly there, but even in a more 'organic' system like 18xx, I see a large amount of gamey strangeness. Take the cyclical dumping of stock in 1830, where each player buys and then sells a share of company X, suffering no loss but inflicting losses on the president. In the real world, other investors would snap up a company that had fallen undervalued, or the president could buy it up himself (no hard limit on percentage of shares) and the traders would suffer some loss of fees. I think there's more end-game effects in AoS instead of 18xx, but that's just because the endgame is much more clearly defined. Or take a 'turn skipping takeover' from 1870. All of these games have bizarre tactics that distance the game somewhat. Whether some are more gamey than others is a matter of taste. I personally haven't had too many AoS games where people did anything other than maximize their income.
• Except of course when they bump someone one point over a ledge. I'll admit that the taxation system is a clunky hack to prevent runaway leaders.
• But I love the game, and am happy to see it here. I could easily see it 30 spots lower, though. I got carpal tunnel after typing loudly for the first 20 games posted, can't expect me to get worked up over the games I like... (he said after typing several hundred words).

I've played plenty of Power Grid [#6] online, and still don't mind playing face to face. I'll be buying the expansion...

Princes of Florence [#5] is a fine game. I can't help but crack a smile at Susan's comment -- "Gaming Nirvana." So many possibilities as to what she meant ... Is it the pinnacle of gaming ("Nirvana -- The ineffable ultimate in which one has attained disinterested wisdom and compassion." Definition A from Dictionary.com) or does the game make you renounce wordly goods and passions ("Emancipation from ignorance and the extinction of all attachment." Definition B)? Perhaps she just means that she's here now, and entertained.

In any case, I shall heretofore refer to games that provide no excitement and attachement as "Gaming Nirvana." Thanks, Susan! [Games that inspire intense hatred will, of course, get thousands of words of bile to describe them]. So let it be written, so let it be done!

Just to keep this at the top ....

Settler of Catan is #4, and El Grande is #3.

I don't think anyone would accuse me of going out on a limb if I predict Puerto Rico and Euphrat and Tigris are the last two games, although order could be argued. [I suspect E&T will win, but I'm not terribly confident of that.]

I want to throw some quotes at you.

• I've played it tons of times and still enjoy it, though the lustre of discovery has faded.
• I can't remember the last time I played this, but MAN did we play it to death when it first appeared
• A dramatically innovative system in a wonderfully fun game...
• This game is variety in a box ... you could play it a multitude of times, and never play the same game twice

Those quotes were all for recent games, but you could easily apply them to Chess or Magic:The Gathering, couldn't you? I mean, I played Chess pretty much exclusively for 3 years. I never played Magic to the exclusion of all other games, but it's probably dominated the lives of most gamers for a little while.

This isn't a criticism of the voters. Neither game makes my current Top 15. I'm just surprised that neither one showed up on 3 lists. [For all I know, the rules preclude CCGs, which would explain Magic].

Mark's comment on Settlers stands out — "It's become "cool" in some circles to crack on Settlers... ".

A lot of voting (or discussions about voting) is about validating yourself. I mean, depending on where you live, admitting that you voted for 'the wrong' Presidential candidates is an act of courage. And I still see bumper stickers for these candidates (and for 2000, although rarer). What is that if not a gigantic statement the owner is making about himself?

[Bloggers live in glass houses for this particular sin.] And while Mark thinks that Settlers has suffered, I think Magic is the real loser. I don't know how times I've played, but 2,500+ seems reasonable and at least 1,000 (but am I 98% confident?) I've played 500+ games of Shadowfist, and I can usually only play it 3-5 times a week on the weeks when I play. My 2nd semester of grad school, I probably played Magic daily. And days with 10+ games occured with some regularity. And I played for years. Magic (and Chess) are probably in my Top 5 of "games played".

But it's really cool to diss the CCG. Magic's demographic makes that somewhat easy. [I routinely go to conventions with kilo-dollars of games left out, and haven't heard of any thefts.]

Tonights debating topic "Resolved — Magic got treated like the crazy ex- we all wish we could forget."

Update: Ok, I was wrong. It was Euphrat #2 and Puerto Rico #1.

Well, no surprises on the final two (although I got the order wrong). Let's wrap this up, Springer-style!

For those keeping score, I've played 93 to 96 of the games I'm not sure about Gipf, Dvonn and For Sale. I think I've played Gipf and For Sale, but it's lost in the haze of time. I definitely haven't played Roads & Boats, Hannibal: Rome vs Carthage, Dune and Africa. I own 63 of the games, so that gives me a conservative Geek Score of 156. Call it 158. And if I'm allowed to count games I owned and then sold, you could add another 11 points. [I count all of the public domain games as owned, since I have at least one strategy book on each of them except Spades (I have a strategy book for Hearts, though).

Despite my worries, the list wasn't horrible, although there are some inclusions to my taste and the odd exclusions that didn't get in [I created a Geeklist. Add your own entries!]

In any case, I'll vote next time, as long as everyone's clear that I'm mainly into the complaining. Good times. Good times...

The Magic discussion is interesting, and I'll concede that I wouldn't have voted for either game, but I'm just surprised that there weren't 3 people (or so) who did. And, contra Lou, I would have voted for a CCG. One of the big differences between Shadowfist and Magic is that 'Fist is primarily multiplayer, which gives it a depth of play beyond magic (and weakens the deckbuilding and card acquisition elements). [I also think that Netrunner was the most interesting 2 player game, Larry.] It's also interesting to note the distribution of 1st place votes. I'm pleased that DBM got a first place vote ... at least one miniatures gamer voted! [I've never played DBM].

Update: Check out Tom Lehmann's Top 15, in the comments.